/Interview/ The brains behind: 419 Eater
05/02/2007 | Filed under Discover > Interview
Mike Berry aka Shiver Metimbers runs 419eater.com and spends his time reversing scams. Now he’s got a book out, Greetings in Jesus’ Name!, that chronicles his scambaiting escapades
.net: What inspired you to create 419eater.com?
MB: Like many people who use the internet, I used to get these scam emails fairly regularly, maybe once or twice a month. I knew that they were some kind of scam, but at that time I had no idea how they worked. Then one day I received several scam emails from the same guy. I decided to reply to him and tell him where he could shove his scam! I sent the message and thought that would be the last time I would hear from him. Well, the next day the scammer replied to me and attached a copy of his passport and a badly faked deposit certificate showing $30million had been deposited in his account. It was obvious that this guy didn’t completely read the message I sent to him. Well, this really got my interest up, so I Googled the scammer’s name, which came up on a few anti-scamming sites that were already out there. For the next few weeks, I did a lot of reading and research, and eventually decided to set up my own site in order to publish my own scambaiting correspondences.
My hope was to raise awareness of these scams by publishing my work. Yes, people would have a laugh reading about these hopeless cases, but at the same time these very people would instantly recognise a 419 scam if they ever received one. If only one person is saved from falling for such a scam, then it will have been well worth all the work.
.net: How much time do you spend on scambaiting?
MB: Presently, with looking after the site, corresponding with members of the public who email me, and dealing with the scammers themselves, I’m spending around four to five hours a day.
.net: What’s the correspondence with scammers like?
MB: There’s no ‘standard’ type of correspondence. The stories change depending on my mood and what the scammer is asking me. Of course, the main thing to do is to keep the scammer interested in me for as long as humanly possible. While the scammer is concentrating his efforts on trying to scam me, hopefully I’ll be keeping him away from real potential victims. Sometimes, I’ll get the scammer to pose for funny photos, travel long distances for a fake payment or create some artwork, but these things are just a by-product of the scambaiting process. The main objective is to keep these guys busy for as long as possible. The average scambaiting correspondence is two to three months, but in many cases it can be much longer. One of my favourite scambaits was called ‘The Tale of the Painted Breast’, which featured a scammer by the name of ‘Prince’ Joe Eboh. This particular scambait lasted several months, and during this period, I got the scammer to join my fake church and undergo an ‘induction procedure’ whereby he had to pose topless and paint his right breast with a red church logo. I also got him to send me $80 in cash as an upfront fee.The scammer wanted me to send him $18,000 for various ‘processing fees’ and I told him there would be no problem getting this, but my bank would charge me an early withdrawal fee of $80. Joe was only too happy to send me the $80 as he was convinced that I would then send him the $18,000. He never got his money, of course, and I sent him various fake photos of myself and my friends spending Joe’s $18,000 in nightclubs, prostitutes, and also starting up a snow exportation business, exporting snow to Siberia!
.net: How do you come up with ideas when you reply to spam?
MB: I usually don’t start out with a specific plan of what I’m going to do when a scammer first contacts me. I may have a vague idea about perhaps getting the scammer to travel long distances, produce some kind of artwork, or perhaps pose with a silly sign, but I never have any specific plans in mind. The way the correspondence unfolds dictates my responses for the most part. For instance, taking the Prince Joe Eboh scambait as an example, I never set out to get money out of the scammer – the opportunity just arose as a result of some of his requests.
.net: How do you get the scammers to send pictures of themselves in bizarre poses?
MB: Most of the time, a scammer will send you a fake passport or driving licence in the early stages, to try to prove his identity or legitimacy to you. I will refuse those on the grounds that, these days, such things are easy to fake, and with fraud so rife on the internet, I tell them I’m afraid I can’t accept it as proof of identification. I suggest that the only way they can prove who they are to me is to have a photograph taken of themselves holding a sign with our agreed ‘password phrase’ written on it. Of course, it’s the scambaiter who decides the password phrase! These signs vary from quite innocent phrases, such as “Hello Mum” through to much funnier and very much naughtier phrases (a little too rude to print here).
.net: How do you get them to comply with your demands?
MB: Usually, we tell the scammer we’re part of some kind of church that can’t do business with the scammer unless they join our church. Of course, to join our church, the scammer has to undergo an initiation ceremony that usually involves some crazy things, such as sitting in a bath full of milk with a goat on your knee, dressing up as characters from TV shows, covering yourself with honey and feathers – the list is endless, and the results can be found in our Trophy Room!
.net: How do the scammers react?
MB: Most of the time, the scammer will threaten the scambaiters when they realise what’s been going on. For the most part, they just give a little bit of abuse and then disappear to find new victims. I’ve had many death threats, via email and by telephone (some death threat recordings can be found on the site). Again, for the most part, they’re empty threats designed to try to scare you into some kind of action, perhaps to apologise to the scammer and even send them some money. Scammer will threaten real victims in such ways. So long as the victim is able to keep paying money, then the scammer will be extremely nice to them. However, when the money starts to run out and victims say they can’t give any more, sometimes the scammers will get very nasty indeed, threatening the victims with violence or even legal action if they don’t find more money from somewhere to pay the scammer. Many times, victims will get so scared, they’ll start to borrow money from friends and family just to pay off the scammer and try to stop the threats.
.net: Do you ever think you go too far?
MB: No. In the past, I’ve had some really evil scammer get himself tattooed with my fake church logo. I don’t do this any more just in case an innocent person is made to have the tattoo on the scammer’s behalf. However, because I know very well how these guys operate and how evil they are, I never lose any sleep over anything I’ve done. Some people think that these scammers are just poor people trying to scrape together a few dollars to feed their families. This isn’t the case. These guys make a lot of money and there are many highly organised scam gangs operating all over the world making many millions of dollars a year. Millions of dollars are being stolen on a daily basis. These riches never filter down to the poor people who need it most. These people are, for the most part, vicious criminals with absolutely no morals whatsoever.
.net: Do you work with the police?
MB: In the early days, I used to send all my scambaiting correspondences, photos and certificates to the scammer’s local police. Sadly, after sending about 300+ emails, I have never once had a reply back, so I no longer bother. We do, thankfully, have some great ‘unofficial’ police contacts that we pass information on to, and members of 419eater have indeed managed to arrange the arrest of dozens of scammers over the last couple of years. It’s a small number, but it’s better than none at all.
.net: How popular is scambaiting?
MB: Scambaiting has become very popular, especially over the last 18 months or so. There are a hundred or so scambaiting sites out there, and perhaps half a dozen large ones. 419eater is by far the largest and most active scambaiting site on the internet, and we have approximately 23,000 registered members. Of those, there’s a hardcore of about 2,000 scambaiters who scambait on a regular basis. Officially, most law enforcement authorities would advise against scambaiting.
.net: Is it the right way to hit back?
MB: It’s dangerous to be communicating with scammers with the intention of wasting their time and resources, and no one should do so without being fully aware of what they’re getting into and how to carefully cover their tracks. Unofficially, we do get a lot of support from the police. Many members of 419eater.com are serving LEOs and many are scambaiters themselves. I receive many emails of support from various LEOs from all over the world. In a way, the site is a good resource for the police, and though we may not be officially supported, we are in some small way helping to lighten their load!
The main ethos of the site is to raise awareness.People who come to the site and read the humorous stories, or take part in our very busy forums are being educated on how to recognise these scams. I would hope that anyone who has visited our site would have been educated enough to never fall for similar scams.
What people need to remember is that the scammers featured on our site are in a very very tiny minority. These are the idiots – the fools who got caught out. And although the scammers featured on our site were all failures, there are tens of thousands of very successful scammers out there, and people need to realise that this is a huge problem that can only be eradicated by educating the public about them. The scam is too easy to pull off, and too easy to get away with, especially for scammers located in western and southern Africa, and no amount of harsher sentences or new laws will stop it.
.net: What’s planned next?
MB: I guess the site will continue in much the same way as it’s going now. I’d dearly love to be able to get some kind of official support, and perhaps even get a real job working with the government tackling this type of fraud, but I won’t hold my breath or give up my current job yet!
.net: Any final tips for aspiring scambaiters?
MB: Don’t do it without arming yourself with information. Never give out your real details. Always use a fake name, fake email address, and even tell the scammer you’re in another country! The scammer you’re corresponding with may well be thousands of miles away on the other side of the planet, but he may well have friend/relatives living in your street! 419eater.com has a mentor system in operation for new scambaiters. An experienced member will help a new scambaiter all the way through his first correspondence, giving help and advice about how to cover their tracks and how to handle various situations. Come to our forums and you’ll find many thousands of like-minded people who’ll be only too happy to help out.
Comments
Johhny Danger / 06/02/2007 / 04:20 / http://theScamBaiter.com
Unfortunately 419 scams and scammers are still going strong.
Luckily there is a group of people out there on the internet putting a damper on their scams!
419eater is good but http://theScamBaiter.com is on a whole other level.
These guys get even with these crooks, and sometimes even get them arrested even though they are in Nigeria.
They are also avidly fighting eBay scammers as well, a terrific group there.
Last year at one time they got a group of scammers arrested; I think the count was around 50 or so.
There is a lot of funny stuff there too, you have to see what they make these scammers to so get "paid", check out their "mugu museum"
http://thescambaiter.com/forum/vbimghost.php?do=userlist
Johhny D
Paul Francis / 06/02/2007 / 09:04
Well done to Mike and all the people over at 419eater.com! I am sick & tired of receiving scam emails now on a daily basis and these SOBs get away with millions every year creating real misery for their victims. My sister in law lost £1200 in a similar scam a couple of years ago. Some jerk posed as a dying widow needing help to move her money out of the country to help her kids. Yes there will be some ignorant people out there that think only rich and stupid people get stung but if thats what you think then you havent a clue about these scams.
Mike you should be knighted or at the very least officially recognised!!!
Lotta / 07/02/2007 / 22:46 / http://www.419eater.com
Great job Mike and a big thanks for all you do to get the word out about these scammers. You are a brilliant baiter!
www419eater.com rocks!
Gary Brade / 07/02/2007 / 22:49
Eater members have had many dozens of scammers arrested on a yearly basis and also fight many other scams too. thescambaiter is not on its own there but have to agree it is indeed on a whole other level... below :-) There is only one scambaiting site worth talking about and 419eater is it. Plugging mediocre ones in its shadows is poor play!!
Joe / 08/02/2007 / 02:18 / http://www.419eater.com
419eater is good but http://theScamBaiter.com is on a whole other level. I would have to disagree, while the scam baiter has its moments 419 eater is still THE baiting site IMO
mark / 08/02/2007 / 06:05 / http://free-wii-nintendo.blogspot.com
I find so many of these 419 scams in my emails. Thankfully most get filtered correctly and end in my junk mail. Extrmely annoying.
Mark C / 08/02/2007 / 08:29
Two words:- Dead Parrot!
Pure genius. Other sites are just very pale imitations, clinging to the scraps of publicity that 419eater feeds them!!
HB / 08/02/2007 / 13:44
Having a family member that introduced me to 419eater, I can honestly say that the work done here must take a bite out of the scammers profits. They are an incredible group of people who's main concern is educating the public about the lowlife scammer. We have a lot of fun scambaiting, but education is really what it is all about. My hats off to MB for taking the time, and sharing his expertise, to keep getting the word out.
kuramo / 17/02/2007 / 05:54
Well done indeed. These 419 pests really make life a misery for some gullible folk. And they clog up the internet too. Shame there has been a poor response regarding their contacts with local law enforcement - but perhaps we can understand that here in the Nigeria, where the Economic and Financial Crimes Commission is all too obviously more interested in political persecution.
Well done chaps, and kudos to .net for highlighting their good work.
Kuramo
kaz / 17/04/2007 / 07:33
hi, i just wanted to share what happened to me recently,,like most people i get a heap of the usual dodgy emails asking me to help someone secure a pesky 14 million bucks or 2,,ha ha ,,what a crock,,,and ocasionally through bordom or maybe too many glasses of wine or whatever,,i started to reply,,(the replys wernt nice believe me), but id never had anyone answer until recently when a certain mister lagobie martin took to emailing me on a regular basis,,,he seemed to take umbridge at my thoughts on scammers, and told me,,"THIS IS NOT JOKING",,,anyway, being the shit stirrer that i am, i decided to have a bit of fun with the guy and lead him on and make him think he had me,,,,,well, ive certainaly regreted that, because since i told him that i was having a lend of him and that i knew all along that it was a crap deal,,,ive had HEAPS of problems with my commputer,,,every time i log on i get virus'ed and someone keeps trying to hack my system,,and i cant help but think its them,,,i stirred the pot and now im paying for it,,,i told him REPEATADLY that i had NO money to steal,,,i told him that i only have my disability pension as income,,,i dont own my house i rent,,i have NO assetts,,,but he wasnt detered,,,i mean the thing is they CANT rip me off cause i have nothing to steal,,,but messing with my p.c pisses me off cause now when i email my son, (he's on deployment in the middle east with the R.A.N), my emails are blocked cause theres possible virus content,,,i just wish i could meet these people and give them a big slap and tell them to have some manners and get a real job,,,,,,signed kaz,,,,angry mother of a sailor at sea...........
Derek / 11/06/2007 / 20:20 / http://www.gimme4free.co.uk
Just about every other email I receive is a scam of some kind. Anything that hurts the scammers is good in my opinion!
barbara / 02/07/2007 / 19:36
I am now receiving a scam at least once a day in my email. Today I received a scam from Canada snail mail. Has anyone gotten a check and lottery win from Citi Trust Financial Inc.? Why would I pay Canadian tax for a lottery I never entered. I believe this is a 419 but they're in Canada now. Oh I also get really interesting job offers from RAC Motorsports and a few others. How do they get my name?
Klaas de Vries Jr / 06/09/2007 / 12:12 / http://www.klaasdevriesjr.nl/
Mike is an inspiration to all. Lets hope his book sells better than mine lol.
Kev / 09/09/2007 / 17:45
419 Eater, IMHO, is simply the best. The others are just mere reflections of the Eater. With that said, I do think that any site that baits these scum are worthwhile and are doing something to waste their time and resources.
Before you ask, NO, I don't feel one bit of sympathy for these criminals that have no limit to how low they will stoop to reach their "Pay Day"
Wyatt / 13/09/2007 / 04:22
Mike:
I really look up to people like you. For just a regular working fellow, you are one of the good guys. A hero saving people from the predators! We love ya....
Mike / 21/12/2007 / 19:02
Any time I'm feeling down, I visit 419eater or scambaiter. A good laugh is as good as a tonic and these guys make me laugh my nuts off! Great to see 419eater fighting back the recent Dos attack, it shows the scammers are really hurting.
Thanks a million, scambaiters.
Mike Brazil / 27/02/2008 / 17:30 / http://www.freeipodsetc.co.uk
To be honest it doesn't get to me like it used to.
I use microsoft outlook express to manage all my emails so whenever there is a spam message it's easy to delete. It doesn't decrease loading time or get in the way of my important emails.
I'm really wary of spam but over the years I find it so easy to spot what is legitimate and what isn't. If it sounds too good to be true then general rule is that it is.
Ntokozo / 31/03/2008 / 12:46 / http://N/A
I too when i feel down or bored, i just visit the 419eater site and trust me i'll be full of smiles the whole day! I really enjoy the stories and the creative thinikng you put behind to get these criminals back. I actually thought you do this for a living, but to my surprise its only but one of yourl 'HOBBIES', but hey i really enjoy your work and i would like you to keep up the great work. 419 EATER IS THE BOMB!! Lol
Jan Kasey / 01/05/2008 / 07:57
Bravo 419eater. These scumbags count on the small % of people who respond. being the gullible ones, making their job easier. This site helps swing the odds against them.
dave / 23/07/2008 / 16:40 / http://www.sunlight-bingo.co.uk
be honest it doesn't get to me like it used to.
I use microsoft outlook express to manage all my emails so whenever there is a spam message it's easy to delete. It doesn't decrease loading time or get in the way of my important emails
Badger Shagger / 12/10/2008 / 20:16
I reply to some of the emails I get from these people. I have one fellow who calles himself Bright Kent and I have written to him under six or more aliases. He has not realised I am wasting his time and he will never get any money. Once I said I had sent moeny to Accrington and not Accra. Another time two of me got married, he porposed to me and I said I had met another he was trying to scam and married him. I have sent him to the Western Union Office on other occasions.
My latest scammer is waiting for to arrive with $50,000 next Saturday, I have sent him my picture which is of Dr Crippen.
